Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:01 Hi, I'm Aaron Swarovski and I'm Austin to Shaw. This is between the keeper. Let's do this. Yes. Chicken off of brand new feature
Speaker 1 00:00:15 To this mega podcast vid cast.
Speaker 2 00:00:19 So today we're going to be talking with Connie Solomon. Um, we're going to cover a lot of everything. That's happened behind his career, where he came from, where he's going, what he hopes to do. And we can't wait to dig in to hear what's going on between his key frames.
Speaker 1 00:00:37 All right. I have a little, I have a little blurb. I'll kick it off. Connie Solomon is an award winning motion design lead at cash app, and he is based in New York city. He's held from the twin, the island Republic of Trinidad and Tobago has diverse skillset in design animation, and compositing allows him to work at any stage of the production pipeline with a high level of proficiency. So Connie is also an alum of SCAD and Momi the motion media department at SCAD. And he's also worked at imaginary forces, uh, where he worked on the Emmy award-winning project, uh, Manhattan title sequence for Manhattan. He's worked on film titles for black Panther, and he's also crossed into the NFP threshold having sold some of his passion projects, his artwork and fun fact Sekani means joy right. Or life. Laughter well it's laughter. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:01:40 Well Joyce close. Okay, cool. Yeah. Cool.
Speaker 1 00:01:44 Welcome to Connie. Thank you for having me guys.
Speaker 2 00:01:47 Well, I'm like really excited, cause I don't know you that well, but I hear about you all the time.
Speaker 3 00:01:52 Yes. I mean I've heard of Swarovski the studio ever since I was in college. So yes. Pleasure meeting and getting the movie as well.
Speaker 2 00:02:04 Yeah. So I have a million questions cause you're like, uh, I would say like a generation possibly behind Austin and I, so I'm curious about like your experience going from school and into the professional world. And um, we're definitely going to show some weave some of your work in throughout the interview. Cause it's really important for people to not just hear us talk to you, but look at like some of the amazing work, but we like to talk about, you know, this bridge between getting your education and landing in the professional world and then where your career is going to go. So while it is about the work, the work is really the work to get to the work, you know? Um, and I think that that is often overlooked in our process. Like a lot of times I'm asked to go speak and they just want to say like Marvel and I'm like, yeah, but what's really important about that job was the to get there because everybody's like, how do you get to work on that? And it's like, well, it starts in school and you start learning and you start growing and you take care of relationships. And so I like, I tend to harp on that, but I would like to hear other people's thoughts about that. Cause you've worked at some amazing places with very prolific TA you know, clients and other talent. And I'm just like really curious about your experience.
Speaker 3 00:03:31 Yeah. Well I think, uh, being an international student helped a lot, um, because I immediately puts an extra driver when you would, because you'll place in the U S isn't by any week guarantee. But also I think another thing that helped me was kind of knowing what I wanted to do from a pretty early age. Like pretty much before I started Scott, I just knew I wanted to get that top motion design and I was already doing it before I came to Scott, which gave me a little bit of a leg up. I remember my freshman year, uh, the second quarters they had the MoGraph competition. It was like a 3d, I think it was for cool bullshit. That's right. Yeah. And I entered and I came second and I was kind of shocked. Uh, but I actually see it in from spring break. I just worked on this project the whole time when everyone else was out doing their thing. And I kind of realized, well, you know, that's how we get the leg up to try to get that advantage. If you work a little bit harder, you know, if you do the extra work, you have the opportunity to kind of get the,
Speaker 1 00:04:37 Yeah. That reminds me of, um, an old like poster flyer thing. I remember seeing it was like, there was no traffic on the extra mile. Yeah. And I remember that, I remember that competition. I remember cause I remember seeing your work before I actually met you. Right. Cause I remember being like, whoa, who's this like, you know, because I was in Savannah, so Connie was in the Atlanta campus and it was like, whoa, this piece is really good. And I remember even all the students too, and Savannah were like, who's this Connie like, this is awesome. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:05:12 Yeah. When I was in Atlanta as well, it was revealed like seeing the work that was coming out to Silvana just keep handing, watch professor Paul Austin Short man, his classes are insane. This is the guy that you want to be learning from. And that's why he eventually came to survive just because, you know, in the Atlanta comp has Austin's classes with so, uh, I'm going to see that it's harmless, but that's the place where you would go to get all the, all the goods, but also quickly realized too, in Atlanta, especially if you only followed the curriculum you work, wasn't going to get to places that you wanted to, you know, I think a lot of the stuff you and your foundational classes there, it's more of a guide kind of guide that you create, but you can't rely on the classes to the technical skills.
Speaker 3 00:05:58 So some of those are the things you really have to jump in as week, a lot of stuff. Uh, so for me, I think it came from my passion to make my that's up, but it also staying in the U S I knew I had to get a job before I graduated. And it was almost like, I don't know, for me, it was always like down how many places I could go like, well, how many opportunities can I get while I was at Scott? So I ended up getting four internships before I graduated. So just ensure that I got, you know, a job, a job, and that, you know, how super important, because I had so much experience before I even really started, uh, my career. I, it gave me an opportunity to kind of feel in a less stressful environment.
Speaker 1 00:06:42 I remember that. Let me see if I can rattle off all your internships. There was LK low Casper. There was the mill, there was imaginary forces and I believe gentlemen, scholar or scholar now. But yeah, I remember that one because I think it was like you were stepping and where you were like constantly stepping out of your comfort zone a little bit with that one, right? Yeah. ELA
Speaker 3 00:07:05 Work. Yeah. Jessamine scholar. Yeah. Cause it was mostly the, and this is like, this video is all in Maya, the super next level. And I haven't started using V-Ray or any. Then I was only using like cinema is standard renderer. You could also go so far, but also the tutorial is teaching you how to make stuff look, next level. Like you have to put the texture and the reflection map to make things look good. Like they have no resources teaching you how to make stuff with good suit CDs. Amazing. Linda's and you had no idea how people achieving with books. It's a lot of stuff you kind of have to figure out what's in your own. Um, so
Speaker 1 00:07:44 What about those? I was going to add, just follow up with the internships. Like what, what was the value of doing internships for you? Uh, during college?
Speaker 3 00:07:55 I think learning just how the industry works is really, I think, important, uh, you know, learning the nuances, uh, communicating with producers, getting feedback <inaudible> alluding to adjust, do work via song people's comments, live, listen, all the little soft things, but also getting to work with people that were better than you, that you can move software from. But also begin to understand like what types of places you want to look at, because if you will, from multiple companies, you can compare and contrast. So you're really giving yourself the best opportunity to launch a career. Cause you could find a place that's best suited for you and the hat. The tricky parts of, to all those internships is that I made coming back. This got difficult because in all your life I worked in the real world, but now I have to take this, I don't know, anthropology class and you know, it made it really difficult. Am I, I took my last class online because I graduated early and I was doing literally, I think it was after apology class while working on imaginary forces, some my working on me and titles. And then I have this other class,
Speaker 1 00:09:07 Sorry, guys, I have to go do homework.
Speaker 3 00:09:09 Right. But it made it very difficult to, yeah. But did you learn something in that anthropology class? I did I pay it off later? Pay it off? No, but I did learn some interesting, interesting things, but yeah, it was also difficult knowing how expensive possibles as well.
Speaker 2 00:09:29 Okay. So what year was that? When did you graduate?
Speaker 3 00:09:32 Oh, this was 2014.
Speaker 2 00:09:34 Okay. I think it's so interesting. We often talk about the pace of how quickly things have evolved in our motion design industry. Like, and we joke about like FedEx and zip disks and all that stuff. Um, but like that wasn't that long ago. And you're talking about like, not having access to tutorials, which is something I think people take very much for granted now is that you can literally go online. And if you have a couple of key words or a place to start, you should be able to find a tutorial or a short class or something that takes you step by step through the process of achieving your goal or damn near close. So I'm just like, what are you guys complaining about? Everything's
Speaker 3 00:10:22 Out there, right? Yeah. Yeah. As long as I get a gift and a kiss too, because now the expectations of that higher, because back then you could just push out a really nice rundown, like, oh my God, I amazing. But now it's like, at least for me it's well, okay, well, you know, what's the idea, you know, because then you could grab it a couple assets from like mega scans. You can make an amazing scene, but you know, does it tell you a message? Is there a story to it? Is there a concept and that's the thing that's like Austin's class, that's the stuff I learned in design school, how to think and design and how to design, how to craft a story, how to craft an idea. And those are the harder, more nuanced things that are more difficult to learn. So it's, yeah, it's a little bit more challenging, but also you have way more resources to learn that stuff. So it's a, yes, it's a fine balance.
Speaker 2 00:11:22 I was really curious, going from imaginary forces and perception moving into, and I don't know if that's the direct route of how you got there, but moving into tech, moving into essentially the tech industry focusing mostly, primarily, I'm assuming on social, you can correct me if I'm wrong, but moving from doing stuff for the big screen that, you know, billions of people are going to see into the small screen and that big kind of pivot. Like maybe there's more, it seems like more freedom, but also less visibility. And I'm curious how that all works for you emotionally and practically and all the things.
Speaker 3 00:12:00 Yeah. That's a good question. I think, uh, that move was very puzzling. A lot of people, us about it. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, I left imaginary forces in 2060, and I leave 2016 and I freelance and a bunch of other companies. And I was like, you know, looking at different companies, I'm trying to figure out why, what do I want to do with my career? I've been, you know, people come in, I come in, I help sometimes I get the chance to conceptualize, but I don't really get tons of ownership over the stuff that I do. And that's why I work on myself. Right. As why I find myself making so many personal projects to kind of be able to have a little bit more ownership over the stuff that I, I do. I ended up working at apple, uh, in 2018 out here. We've kind of opened up my eyes like a whole different life in the industry because people were significantly less all is they call a lot more money.
Speaker 3 00:13:01 Um, I knew is the difference with apple was the work was a little bit more constraint. Then I got a message from a recruiter on LinkedIn from square, uh, for Java cash app. And I went in and I was very surprised to see what the other established yeah. Even. So it'll be on is that they wanted the brand to be very artful and art focused. And it real really allowed me to be creative and to have a lot of ownership of that. And a lot of it is just kind of recognize the opportunities here when something's rare. I, I didn't, I couldn't name any of a place that was doing that. Like I was doing. I can do multi level work about level work for a tech company and still get all the benefits. So that was, uh, a really got good combination for me.
Speaker 3 00:13:49 So it kind of starts it off doing more social stuff, but no, I think we were branching out. Like we just launched a campaign. That's going to be on YouTube and connected TV, which was a project that I led last year. And then it's a whole bunch of other, um, initiatives. But even like when we're doing stuff in app, you know, we have between like 35 to 40 million users, that's we need, we need doing notifications. That's going out to millions of people, uh, people as well. Yeah. Or even on social. So you still, you know, get the eyeballs and as you know, being part of a company that's scaling, I think the initiative is only getting bigger and bigger on a
Speaker 1 00:14:30 Field like you guys to do like a clothing line or something. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:14:33 Yeah. We did it. Right. You know,
Speaker 1 00:14:37 Connie worked. Cause I remember you, you did like a lot of 3d with the designs for the clothing, right? Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:14:46 Like we made a couple of the pieces, uh, in 3d so we could visualize, it was such an interesting process. Like we visualized a lot of the clues, uh, in 3d before they actually got samples. So I would see what the fabric looked like and I would recreate them in 3d at that. And like soon after we'd get the actual examples. So that's amazing. So
Speaker 1 00:15:09 You kind of get to the prototype. You did say something, I remember talking to you a while back and you would describe text some, some tech as this sort of a retirement community for, for old motion designers.
Speaker 2 00:15:27 I can't say that you're wrong. Most of like most of the really super talented artists that I work with early in my career. So the early two thousands into, you know, like 2005, they're at apple, they're doing great work, but they're there.
Speaker 3 00:15:43 Right. Well, I still have, because you know, early 2010s you would do all these superstars. And then I realized, I wouldn't hear from them as much. Cause I'm like, wherever you want to go. And I went to apple, I'm like, oh wait you here. Yeah. I'm like, oh, okay. So this is where everyone's hanging out. I get it. It's just like we asked a studio without work-life balance. It's tough, you know, working, you know, 9, 10, 11 at night. Or like even my experience was like nuts. Never leaving 20
Speaker 1 00:16:19 Hour days. Yeah. Boy,
Speaker 3 00:16:23 The doctors one at night know like people sleeping over in the studio together and it's tough to do that time off the time with, you know, family, as you get older, you, you really start to pay attention to where your time is going. So, you know, I got it to me. It was just more so like where can I find the balance of work? That's just a little bit less constraint than apple. Um, but you know, I can still get some of those benefits.
Speaker 1 00:16:50 No, I mean, and to be clear, I mean, from, it sounds like, like cash cash app is
Speaker 2 00:16:56 A really awesome blend of like really cool
Speaker 1 00:17:00 Work boutique culture, a lot of freedom, flexibility. But some of that tech infrastructure in terms of, uh, work-life balance, like didn't like, I remember you were telling me it was like unlimited vacation time. I don't know if you want to talk about this or not yet.
Speaker 3 00:17:17 Well, a little bit of a trade. Right? Well,
Speaker 2 00:17:19 I was gonna ask about that as a business owner because there's no way I would do that. Nobody would talk me into that place, listening to that, that way. Well, actually
Speaker 3 00:17:29 You'd be surprised because people think they can take vacation anytime they want. Sometimes we actually take less vacation, then it usually will. Like, you'd kind of be surprised. It's a mental thing. Like honestly, I think people take much more vacation than the usually widow with, you know, like the typical vacation plan. And I think a lot of tech companies realize that and be like, oh, well we can offer unlimited vacation, but you know, more than likely, no, one's going to take like three months off a year. Like, that's not like, no one's going to do that. But it is still nice knowing you could just take this off. What do you need to,
Speaker 1 00:18:08 Is there like an implicit understanding that it's like, Hey, you can take off whenever you want, but you still got to get your work done. Like, yeah. Right. Like, like as long as you get it done, like your time is yours, right. Is that yes.
Speaker 2 00:18:21 You have like deadlines like you did, like on a studio side or is it a little bit more fluid?
Speaker 3 00:18:29 Oh, it is definitely, definitely that's deadlines. And they have been a lot of times when I've had to work like lists or work on weekends. But the difference is like save the cash by cash out projects. If it's a project that you're leading and you have this grand idea that she went and executed on, that's a little bit of your fault, but you're kind of working towards a vision that you helped establish. So it doesn't really feel like, oh my gosh, it's more like, you know, unjust project. Um, which is cool. You know, so yeah, there's, there's a little bit more attachment, but there's more accountability as well, you know, for project at school. Well, the buck stops with a few people, so that's why you have unlimited vacation, but you have to be mindful of if you're off for too long, it's going to reflect on the world, but that's also a good management comes in. If you could mind your time and manage your projects. Well, people should be able to take vacation without, you know, feeling guilty. Yeah. As a manager myself now, you know, when, you know, people ask for vacation, I have to that into consideration, but I think we do a pretty good job getting that.
Speaker 2 00:19:43 I do have a question, cause this was hard for me, the pivot, the transition. And it's something that Austin and I talked about, I think in an episode where that's not out yet. And that is about the transition from being solely an artists to then managing other people and other people's career and how there's kind of two skill sets there. Like I think it was in the context of, um, me saying like when I have like a really senior animator, that's like amazing and they want to start being more of a creative director leader, but they're like not the best writer or they just don't have those soft skills that make somebody like aware of those things for there's ego there that makes it more about them than about like other people that could be a difficult transition into leadership. And I think at that point it's fair to, for a studio to say, or like the leadership of the company to say like, yeah, but like you're doing great as like an animator.
Speaker 2 00:20:41 I don't want you to be a leader. Like, and I, I think we don't talk about that an industry because there's this natural like progression people want to do in their career. They want to take that next step. And that next step is often becoming the leader. Even if their personality and the traits at, you know, don't really match up with it. I think somebody could just ask for more money then like just say, yeah, well I'm a very senior animator and this is what I do. Like at that point, just ask for more money. Don't necessarily ask for different responsibility. I think that's fair to say, but I'm curious about your thoughts on it. Cause you've obviously like been through the transition or handling it very thoughtfully.
Speaker 3 00:21:24 You know, that's a really, really, really good point. Yeah. It is a different skill set. Like it's one thing to be able to make something, you know, how to make, it's another thing to try to convey to someone else the thing that there is to be make and have them make it in a sit away. But a lot of it too, I've realized, I, I realize is sometimes you just have to give someone a jumping off point because there's a reason you're hiring an artist is to get their perspective. And it's like this balance of, you know, you want to give them guidance, but allow them some flexibility to create their best work. And you know, you kind of give them feedback to guide them on that journey. And I think, you know, being like working with a lot of good creative directors and kind of see out if managing proton the best in people, I mean, especially myself, like push it, people, it's this fine balance.
Speaker 3 00:22:13 You got to push them enough, but not too hard. So yeah, it's a lot of nuanced things. Even you kind of have to learn, but there's a grades of conversation, um, to your point about artists feeling the need to have to jump into being like a creative director and an art director, because so much of those skills, it's just communication and being able to articulate ideas. Like, I mean, that's pretty much the job I'm being able to like see things from a big picture standpoint. Not everyone can do that. And it's definitely something you have to learn, but this is a great thing also about cash is that to advance your career, you never have to be like an art director or director. You could be a very senior motion designer and get paid the same as a creative director. That's my point. Right? Like we have two tracks, you know, you could take, you could do the IC chalk it, which is an individual contribution that if you go to the management track, um, or there's no, you know, really pushing for them to have, you know, kind of equal pay. So, you know, it feels pressure to go that route, like creative direction, obviously a skill, but nothing is creative, a thought the artist, right. And then, you know, artists also needed guidance. Uh, cause not every artist could think in a big picture way. It's sometimes they get really into the weeds and they think about the technical stuff. So, you know, I think that's a more fair way of assessing, you know, people's career opportunities and then some not. So if we get it and feel it out and see what people want to do with stickers,
Speaker 1 00:23:49 It's interesting. It's like just that idea of, I mean, I constantly talk about it in classroom, that idea of like finding the right fit. Right. And whether it's, whether it's like finding a job at the right fit of a studio or if it's finding the right role and it's, I mean, it's tough. I mean, I don't know, I guess with, with, with students, especially like when they're younger, you know, they don't always know. And I think it's true. I remember like being an intern and seeing the like creative director and just being like one day I want to be a creative director. Right. Like, just because it seems like that's the, that's the hierarchy, right? That's the aspiration. Um, um, it's just, uh, popped in my head. Like something, I don't know how to work with that with students. Maybe it's just having these types of commerce
Speaker 2 00:24:38 Conversation. Well, listening to people like us talk about that nuance of like, it's okay to not go that route or to think about it before. You're like, I want to be this cause it's a whole different
Speaker 3 00:24:51 Yeah. Well, I mean like naturally some titles just song, grant, group, creative director. Right. You know, I was like, oh wow. He's a, he's a big shot. And when you think about progression, that's typically in pretty much most industries, how people progress in their career. So I think it's natural, but I think now people are beginning to understand that it's not the only way to do things.
Speaker 2 00:25:17 Yeah. I know. Like I changed my title based on the job and my role in it. Like there's so if you look at our pitch deck, sometimes I'm the executive creative director with a creative lead or another creative director under me. That means like, Hey, I'll pop in. You know? Yeah. You'll see me every once in a while, I'll make a joke. But sometimes I'm the creative director and that means I'll be very heavily involved in your job. And sometimes I'm the director. Right. And then sometimes like I'm actually a designer on something and that's, those are like, those are different mindsets when you're doing them. Austin, you talked in our freelancer episode about how, when you go to a place you sometimes are brought in as a creative director. Sometimes you're brought in as a designer. Sometimes you're brought in as like a educator and how we pivot based on, you know, what the needs are of that situation.
Speaker 1 00:26:11 So sort of that personas the personas of, of, uh, motion designer, really generalists. Yeah. Right. That makes me curious, like how did this, this kind of structure at, at cash app? Like how, who, who came up with this?
Speaker 3 00:26:26 Oh, well I think that's something is seen in a lot of tech companies as well. You think about engineers, you know, like a lot of software engineers, so you just want to code and what you're going to tell, like of high level, super hard to find software engineers. It's like, we're not going to give you more money because you're not managing, you know, and right. If you lose that post and he goes to your competitor has a direct impact on revenue. So he was seeing that as smart to just pay that person more, to keep them, yeah. Some of these companies, they just makes so much money. It's like,
Speaker 1 00:26:58 Right. It doesn't matter. It's okay. Just,
Speaker 3 00:27:02 Yeah. Right. You know, we don't want you to go to a competitor and the talent pool is small. I mean even in motion design, I think in a lot of, oh my God. So small. Yeah, exactly. All that section off. So yeah. I think it's definitely keeping people happy if it means you can retain them in a lots of doubts. It's just giving people options.
Speaker 2 00:27:25 Yeah. I mean, that's, this is a really interesting conversation because obviously like motion design department or communication department is reflecting the model for their engineers. And that makes sense. And like, when you think about studios, like we are reflecting either old school, post houses, right. Or where you have like the director at the studio and they're everything or agencies who have like, basically it's much more closely, you know, like even my studio is like a blend of both of those things where we have like some pillar people and then the agency model under them. And it's like, interesting. Like if you are going to grow it from the ground up, what would it really look like? Yeah. That's fascinating.
Speaker 1 00:28:12 Yeah. Merging of models.
Speaker 2 00:28:14 Well, I mean, it made sense. I mean, everything back in the day when we started, it was just like figuring out how to make things, let alone, who was in charge. And it really was like the most charismatic person as the one that talked to the client, the one that could get them to bite on the direction or all those. So those are the people that kind of became the creative directors. But now there's, there may be this, this bigger question to ask of what really should the structure be.
Speaker 3 00:28:39 Yeah. And you know, some of that has to be ego as well. You know, people seem like I'm this person I'm up here, which I got people who put in the time, but it worked. But I think there's just arguments to be made that to, you know, I hate this term, but when people like Brickley as people actually doing the work should be compensated, I think failure, failure. But just like, they shouldn't feel like they have to do a job that they might not be good at just to advance their careers.
Speaker 2 00:29:12 I totally agree when they're excelling and like leveling up and more productive, they should be compensated more. That's
Speaker 3 00:29:20 Why you see there's a lot of bad managers and not good directors, because again, people made that switch and some people might've felt like they're forced to do that and that's not what they want to do.
Speaker 2 00:29:34 Yeah. Or it just doesn't suit them. Right. And so it's like very combative. It's like, whoa, doesn't need to be like this. Yeah. Now how big is your team now? How have you hired anybody?
Speaker 3 00:29:48 Yeah. I personally need a team of five. Okay.
Speaker 2 00:29:53 So you're, you're cruising. You're getting you're growing.
Speaker 3 00:29:55 Yeah. Yeah. But like the design of org as a whole, and this is like both products and creative design. I like 60 people at this point. It's like, it's a lot, but that's really not like product people actually designed the app and then, you know, creates a competition of like, you know, I'm emotional as it is so 2d, 3d animation, but then, you know, this illustrates it as there's graphic designers, they're like industrial designers is a whole slew of different types of professions and types of people that you work with, you know, which is also interesting, like copywriters as well.
Speaker 2 00:30:31 Yeah. Yeah. You gotta write it. Totally. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:30:36 He is so important. No one ever. Yeah. Because
Speaker 1 00:30:40 Well, like the whole like art forward, uh, brown that, you know yeah. Like what are the conversations like around, around the branding direction?
Speaker 3 00:30:51 Yeah. We're at this point now where, you know, we're scaling a lot. So the idea is, you know, how would you be expressed with brown is for someone who's so strong because if you've been there for myself, there's like an Indian understanding because you've been doing it full with a while. But how do you express that to someone that comes in and a lot of it to know, because the brand is so diverse is how do you articulate what it does to someone so they could capture that. And it's definitely a challenge because we could have gone the roadway. It's like Shrek style guides and they'll go is three in this X code can only be used at this way. And these are how things you do brand-wise but we did it go in that direction. You wanted to do something to you that felt a little bit more contemporary, especially for C uh, Jesse, it
Speaker 2 00:31:40 Feels like the early days of MTV with the moon man. It was like they had this thing. And I mean, I would make mix VHS tapes, I'd watch MTV. And through like, you know,
Speaker 3 00:31:51 It's funny that you say that because the comparison we make is MTV and its like U S is it, boom. Well, see this is the thing you convenient brand by a feeling more so than like a specific aesthetic vibe. But it's also hard to communicate how you recreate that. Um, because people will have certain points of view. So it's a, it's an interesting challenge, an interesting way to build a brand as well. And how do you maintain that magic as you scale is something to also try to create. Hey,
Speaker 1 00:32:27 Thanks for listening to part one of her interview.
Speaker 0 00:32:30 Connie check back in two weeks for part two and four from between the key frames.
